Yay or Nay on EVs?

Just for fun!
, ,
21

Yeah, but…

All you say can be true, but look at the real facts.

The USA is not the world, but a part.

And the world is changing to EVs faster than you can say “middle class”.
Just as the 3rd world jumped the cost of land lines for G5 mobile, they are doing the same here.

And why? Because China has built a EV industry that offers cheap transportation, but for the problems you mentioned.

Of course the US and Europeans car makers are all - in, because there are “other Facts” involved. Like…

  1. Like be a human, walking down the sidewalk, along a road that is bumper to bumper traffic, and the air is pure. Oh what a powerful want.

  2. And, generally - pollution over the lifetime of the car, surely is much less.

Personally, I think the only reason most are against is because we Americans Built the Car. It is in our DNA. Very hard to change. While the rest of the world, the Indonesians, or Indians, or Kenyans, or Peruvian could care less, and do not drive the distances we do.

Anyway - Revolt all you want - Yell from the tree tops your facts.

Detroit, Germany, and Japan are going after the $$$ - Electric Cars

3 Likes
22

Back to the OP…

“Yay” to the EV with much, much understanding. Past, Present and Future.

We have had two EV’s our first for three years, our second is now 5 years old. A full 8 years of white knuckle range anxiety.

First off both cars were/are no larger than a sheet of plywood. The range is 60-110 miles depending on the time of year. Winter, 60 miles if we don’t use heat… Summer 110 miles if we don’t use air-conditioning. Argued by some, but the only convertible EV sold in America.

The first EV called a ED (they removed that, not sure why, but use your imagination) the second a EQ. The first one took 4.5 hours to charge. The second one takes 3 hours to charge from empty. This on a 220 60 amp service. Total cost if we pay to charge it at home. Three cents a mile. Never put in a quart of oil, just have paid for new tires and a cabin air filter in 8 years.

However, the second one is on the third battery. These cost $25,000 on a $30,000 car. So the manufacture has provided $75,000 in batteries. We spent $30,000, fine with us. We do know, one day it may stop, now not under warranty and die with no grave to put her in.

The little guy burns Oil, Natural Gas, Nuclear Fuel, Coal, Solar and Trash. All provided through a little #6 3 wire charge station. Not going to be political, but why do 5 out of those 6 fuel types “Save the Planet?”

Only a motor, no engine. For this reason we must charge when we travel more than 50 miles from home. If someone with a “Plug in Hybrid” is using the charger we don’t get to go home. That problem has increased over the last 8 years. Most we meet are nice when we explained why we need to charge to get home. Some never know, or will never get it.

So much more practical, emotional, business and engineering info to share, but for now the charger is set to engage in a few hours. Overnight when we sleep, when people don’t need the power.

4 Likes
23

:thinking: :thinking: :thinking:

image

image
image

4 Likes
24

That’s crazy. There’s a glut of unsold EV’s in the country right now. Automakers strive to hit 60 days of supply as their goal. At the moment that number for EV’s sits well over 100.

Not very American. Aren’t we supposed to be able to choose what we want around these parts?

4 Likes
25

I’m reminded of this exchange:

As far as I can discern from the Recorded History of recent decades, far too-many members of We The People seem to have lost sight of the ever-present - and ever pressing - need for using our heads for more than mere hat-racks, as ol’ Ben & many another of the Founding Fathers evidently presumed would continue to hold sway, through thick and thin.

The available evidence strongly suggests that various corporate conglomerates have noticed that shirking of foremost duty - and leveraged such ignorance to fleece our coffers.

Unashamedly, dadgummit.

It may be that the French philosopher Maritain said it best:

5 Likes
26

I actually looked at opening up an “EV Battery Repair” shop, or maybe a chain of them, as many of the car packs will fail, and can be repaired by replacing only a few cells. The job is doable, but the job safety and insurance hurdles are just too high. I’d love to offer someone a “fix your battery” service for $2K rather than the $20K the manufacturer wants for a new battery pack, but there’s no way that I could hire anyone but former unexploded ordinance specialists. The damn things are not made to be easy to work on, and errors or even a simple dropped tool could suddenly become fatal when trying to de-fang (discharge) the pack. A several hundred pound “disposable battery” - utter negligence by the manufacturers.

10 Likes
27

I admit I’m very conflicted as my Nationalistic Jingoism goes when it comes to EV’s

EV’s are a great idea, but they are just not there yet in terms of technology and economies of scale - this obviously tailspins into the chicken egg dilemma - no investments, no technology - but without market share, the current PE valuation bubble is eventually going to burst - then what?

That Tesla is essentially an American company had me rooting for it from the get go - outside of the companies origins and Elon’s antics - just on this alone.

But like all underdogs, Google, Amazon, Tesla - they eventually become the ring bearers and their origins don’t matter and operate like machines they eventually become the Coal powered Warworlds they were meant to replace.

I think I made a salad out of those references.

Typed too fast without editing - Harken with caution…or is it Harkonnen?

4 Likes
28

The conversation is an independent one. After COVID the days of the long commutes have ended for a lot of people and work from home is the go to for many. There is no point in owning a gas powered vehicle if you only drive 100 miles a month and you have the most basic solar system that comes with modern homes.
This whole, EV yes or no question is about utilization, like asking “Yay or nay on pickup trucks”.
My wife works from home now, so why would I buy her a gas powered car, when we generate excess on our home solar monthly?
You cannot measure the success or failure of EV’s in the current window of time they have been economically available and the underlying national infrastructure has even remotely been operational.

5 Likes
29

We are a two-car family where both drivers WFH. We combine trips and carpool ourselves whenever possible. I had a medical appointment yesterday, but we use my (very small, pre-kids 2 and 3) car so rarely now that my battery was dead.

When we pass that car to our eldest, we’re seriously wondering whether we even need a second car–and if yes, then maybe just one of those tiny clown cars that go max 50mph? :sweat_smile:

4 Likes
30

Well, except for all the companies that are calling workers back to the office because they are finding all the problems with remote work.

"Morris, in the memo, said the decision to relocate employees and ask other remote staff to come back into the office was made to facilitate better collaboration, innovation “and move even faster.” "

Others are doing the same -

" Many large companies are starting to demand workers come into the office at least part of the week. Last November, Snap announced that it would ask its employees to come into the office at least 80% of the time, starting this February. In January, both Starbucks CEO Howard Schultz and Disney CEO Bob Iger asked employees to come into the office for most of the week."

I’m going to guess that at least some of them read all the accounts of how many remote “workers” were actually taking TWO (or more) jobs and using ‘jigglers’ to show they were working.

2 Likes
31

OK, need to do a mod step-in and remind everyone that we at SAS don’t have a great track record on discussing remote v in-office work without personal insults and politicization, so I’m not going to delete @dwat0870 's comment at this time but kindly request that we stick to EVs.

Thanks!

ETA: Closing temporarily because several are replying, just want this to be seen before additional posts.

3 Likes
36

I had premonition that you would post Zeihan on this post…

…wish I thought of something better to come true, but it was this and it happened.

Let it be known.

2 Likes
37

Sticking to EVs, my wife and our son have had an RC store for about 25 years now and have gone from Ni-Cad to Lipo and beyond.

About 20 years or so ago there was a story in one of the publications about a university that was developing a battery made out of PAPER. It could be produced without the chemicals and issues that other batteries had and could be basically molded into the frame of any car being produced.

I can’t find the story anymore and I would have to dig DEEP into my archives since I’m sure I copied it to Facebook or whatever else I had at the time.

It was really interesting and much better environmentally so it probably got bought and buried someplace.

3 Likes
38

Once you decide. you may wish to rethink that decision.

It is a month since we decided to return one of our leased vehicles and not replace it.

Two people with nothing resembling a real job. A job would only keep us from doing other things which require getting out of the house.

It is a real adjustment. Between medical appointments, social engagements, and other activities involving human contacts in a variety of venues, it takes a real effort to coordinate schedules so there are no conflicts over the use of one car. We do not put on many miles but we have many differing destinations.

It is going to require some use of Uber and Lyft, as well as our local senior bus service to complete the adjustment. Keeping our common calendar up to date takes more effort than we thought it would.

At any point we may break down and lease another car if it does not become easier.

Our garage is a common garage for the condo, under all of the apartments and it is unlikely we or any of our neighbors would want the risk of EV batteries or a charger.

4 Likes
39

I forgot the latest issue with my friend’s Mustang Mach E.

Battery overheating risk if charged to 100%. The fix, software upgrade to stop charging if the battery reaches 90%.

Uncomfortable, but far more fires from electric bicycles.

2 Likes
40

As a decades long owner of a horse and buggy, I just think it is wrong that the government is spending our national resources on this new fangled thing - the auto mobile.

I mean we have millions of healthy horses in the country already. Why change?

These auto mobiles

  1. Are too fast, and will surely kill people.

  2. Are too complicated ( a horse has no clutch - for gosh sake !)

  3. Need petrol stations to fill up (not a bale of hay - found everywhere)

  4. Imagine the danger due to petrol explosions, and the such - the horrors.

  5. The cost of feeding and care of the horse is FAR CHEAPER.

  6. What of the cost to bulid roads? Traffic Lights, etc.

  7. My horse has NO RANGE limitations. What if I get stuck with no filling station around in miles?

  8. Obsolescences - The Horse has been here for 1,000’s of years. This auto is a passing fad.

  9. And do not get me started with the smoke these mo - biles belch. Horrible.

OK, my best horse (mr.ed - a horse is a horse of course…) is a fine eater and “depositor”. But that is (beside the smell, and a good pair of rubber boots) a windfall for the sellers of heating fuel. Natural and reclyclable.

just do not get it?

10 Likes
41

Just ask @Dogtamer, he has copies the NSA is still asking for.

9 Likes
42

:clap:t3:

4 Likes
43

Oh, great.

I already have an unfavorable IFF Mark XXII-Mode S identification on the NAS’ radar, and now this…

:grin:

8 Likes