[NYT] I Trained at an Amazon Center in Hangzhou. You’d Be Surprised What They Think of Trump

[Paywalled Link] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/16/opinion/trump-tariffs-china-ecommerce.html?smid=tw-share

NYT - Opinion - Guest Essay - By Moira Weigel. 04/18/25

In China, one of many nicknames for President Trump is Chuan Jianguo. It literally translates as “Trump the Nation Builder.” My best translation is “Comrade Trump.” The joke is that Mr. Trump is a patriotic son of China who is diligently advancing Chinese interests by causing chaos in the United States.

I learned about these memes from friends I made last summer while training as a merchant in Amazon’s official recruitment center in Hangzhou and as a Temu seller in Shenzhen. The companies are part of an enormous e-commerce ecosystem that has become central to global retailing and to the global economy. This ecosystem is deeply rooted in China and includes manufacturers of goods, sellers of goods online, and those who peddle software and services to both groups. Amazon, the millennial-cute Etsy, the bargain shopping app Temu, the fast-fashion retailer Shein and even Google and Meta — all are dependent on millions of China-based sellers.

In 2023, Temu, purveyor of a huge range of goods, from mittens to mobile homes, became the single largest buyer of ads on Meta, The Wall Street Journal reported last year, where its parent company, PDD Holdings, is one of the largest buyers of ads on Google. (Temu disputes the amount spent.) Analysts estimated that Shein spent $200 million on Facebook and Instagram ads in just the third quarter of that year.

It would not be such a stretch to say that Amazon is as much a Chinese company as an American one: More than half of its top sellers are in China, and the fees these third-party sellers pay to use Amazon’s marketplace are one of its largest sources of revenue.

This dynamic explains why the stiff China tariffs imposed by Mr. Trump are unlikely to achieve his goal of returning manufacturing jobs to the United States. Instead, the tariffs will force Americans to pay more for the same prosaic goods they’ve always gotten from Amazon. They will also push the Chinese Amazon ecosystem to broaden its horizons and, in doing so, strengthen China’s economic power throughout the world.

There are over 100,000 Amazon sellers in the city of Shenzhen, a bustling metropolis just north of Hong Kong where the Pearl River estuaries empty into the South China Sea. Many smaller companies sell ordinary products (plastic water bottles, rubber hoses, Christmas lights) under obscure, even bizarre, brand names. Other manufacturers are Goliaths. The Chinese electronics manufacturer Anker, founded in Shenzhen to create replacement laptop batteries but quickly realigned to make charging devices for electronics, has about 5,000 employees and $3 billion in annual revenue.

Amazon shoppers’ loyalty is typically not to any one seller, but to Amazon itself. Once they arrive at Amazon’s website, shoppers overwhelmingly prioritize what Amazon shows them first.

Given this, Amazon shoppers may not notice the impact high tariffs will have on smaller sellers, which tend to lack the capital and resources to absorb such instability. Similar to what happened in the summer of 2021, when Amazon abruptly suspended tens of thousands of Chinese stores it suspected of buying fake reviews, the companies that fail will be swiftly replaced and forgotten.
American shoppers are more likely to notice higher prices for their goods. The vast majority of Amazon products, for instance, are made in China. Many American Amazon sellers source their products there. They, like their China-based counterparts, will eventually be forced to raise their prices because they have such low profit margins as it is.

Most economists dismiss the idea that the tariffs will help bring manufacturing jobs back to the United States. Some question whether America should even attempt to draw them back. The Chinese government has spent decades making massive investments in education, infrastructure and research. And while the cost of Chinese labor has gone up, it is still significantly lower than the cost of American labor. Exemptions announced over the weekend for smartphones, computers and other electronics — promptly followed by cautions that they may well be temporary — have caused more chaos and consternation.

Over the medium to longer term, American tariffs could benefit China. There is evidence that many Chinese sellers avoid tariffs by employing third-party companies that conceal the full value of their goods or their place of origin. Goldman Sachs estimates that such practices helped Chinese businesses evade $110 billion to $130 billion in tariffs from the first Trump administration. Many American sellers who import from China say these sleights of hand put them at a disadvantage. And if the tariffs push the United States into a recession, consumers will be looking to save, a shift Chinese sellers’ global push will also most likely benefit from advances in artificial intelligence that will allow manufacturers to produce and manage more products, translate their advertising into different languages and research new overseas markets more effectively than ever before.

In the past, sudden disruptions to China’s global e-commerce industry have accelerated innovation. In Shenzhen, Amazon’s 2021 mass suspension of accounts still feels like an active trauma. One businessman who told me about it when I visited last summer almost wept. But it was also a key reason that many merchants migrated to Temu as it began pouring money into expanding into the United States. Temu launched in September 2022. By the end of 2024, analysts estimated that Temu had sold over $50 billion of goods, and Apple confirmed that Temu’s app was the year’s most downloaded on iPhones in the United States; according to Similar Web, a data analytics platform, in February 2025, Temu’s U. S. website received almost one billion visits.

Then there’s the Trump administration’s decision to end an exemption that has long allowed e-commerce businesses to ship packages worth less than $800 into the U.S. duty-free. Although the shift will hurt online sellers like Temu that specialize in selling inexpensive goods, the company anticipated the change and had already begun encouraging merchants to send larger shipments to warehouses in the United States, rather than selling directly to customers. That is driving the growth of Chinese third-party logistics companies, often owned or operated in partnership with friends and relatives in the United States.

So perhaps it makes sense that so many Shenzhen merchants seem to admire Mr. Trump as a businessman, if not as a leader. Their affection, as I understand it, is complicated, as their admiration is now tempered with upset at his new tariff regime. Some tell me that the fondness for Mr. Trump is mostly a joke. But many share a sense that, however painful they may be in the short term, the tariffs will eventually spur China to assume its rightful place as the world’s leader and the beacon of a new phase of globalization that’s no longer centered on America.

On Taobao, a Chinese domestic e-commerce platform, you can buy a ceramic statue of Mr. Trump to bring good luck to your business. The original is called Xi Tian Dong Fo Tu Lan Pu: Trump, the all-knowing Buddha of the West, or Western Heaven. Now, there are knockoffs on Amazon for $45 to $50 from storefronts with names like Nagelbag and DFGHJ. With Comrade Trump at your side, or solemnly meditating on your dashboard, the future ahead is bright. to benefit Shenzhen’s many Amazon sellers who specialize in inexpensive goods.

Plus, tariffs create a strong incentive for Chinese sellers to try to sell their goods elsewhere. For the past two years, their government has been calling on businesses to chuhai, or go global, and expand to Africa, Latin America, and Central and Southeast Asia.

Amazon introduced a distinctive kind of globalization that made the Shenzhen ecosystem possible. And as the tariffs drive China to globalize in the rest of the world, this ecosystem, which relies on Amazon’s massive platform and data for its survival, can lead the way. There’s a reason the Chinese government partnered closely with Amazon for the past 10 years.

[Mod Edit by @Pepper_Thine_Angus to add article link]

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There is definitely a lot of truth in this essay, and a probably accurate reflection of opinion at the Chinese Amazon center.

what is still absent is what is absent in much of the predictions of what consumers will pay is whether the full cost of the tariffs will flow though to the American consumer.

The past tariffs started by TJT and continued by JRB did not all flow through to the American consumer.

Some Chinese Manufacturers reduced their prices to partially defray the tariff costs. Some of the resellers in the US absorbed some or all of the tariff costs.

Obviously, the biggest resellers got concessions and support while the tiny ones did not. It is the an old story, those who are already winners get help and the losers get gone.

I have no clue how much more I or any other retail buyer will be paying, but I firmly expect to have fewer sources for my purchases on Amazon than before this round of tariffs started.

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I can tell you as a matter of fact that at least in my industry costs are going up. 85% of RM’s for supplements come from China. They are exempt from the 145% or whatever ridiculous # we are up to these days but not the 20%.

My partner owns a sizeable contract manufacturing operation and is splitting the increase with his clients. So everything is going up 10% as reflected in the RMs.

The part that jives with your opinion is the true % of cost that is actually affected. In my industry it’s variable but on most things, it’s under 10%, and only on the active RM. If the manufacturing occurs in the US, the lionshare of the cost is not affected.

Fictitious example:

Bottle of Vitamin C 500mg.

  • Bottles / Caps are blown / made in the US - no tariff impact
  • Labels are printed in the US - no tariff impact
  • Labor is in the US - no tariff impact
  • Excipients are mostly made here or can be sourced here if needed - no impact
  • Vitamin C (Ascorbic Acid) - Impacted

Let’s say the total cost for the product is $2. The ascorbic acid portion of that might be 25 cents total.

So now, this product would cost $2.05 to make with the 20% tariff. Might need to tack on another 10 or so cents in the case where some of the plastic RM for the bottle / cap / foil seal comes from abroad.

There’s really not anything there that would justify a consumer cost increase. It’s a high margin, highly competitive category with room to hold prices.

This will be the case on a lot of things but nowhere near everything and some things will be massively impacted.

So I can both agree and disagree with your opinion here. The impact will not be what most fear but prices will be going up on avg and substantially in some categories.

New cars will be out of reach for a lot of people if the next phase of auto parts tariffs goes into effect. I think there will be a lot of sticker shock in new car dealers a month from now and even more shock 2 months from now.

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Costs are going up in my industry. The letters keep coming out to the tune of “we don’t know how much because of the fluidity of the situation”

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Even with just the 20%, companies in my industry are setting up shop in China with boots on the ground to cut out the distributors (middleman), to avoid the tariffs altogether (cost savings).

That’s only the really big companies that are doing this now but we can’t be the only industry making that move…

That’s going to hurt the distributors here and lead to job cuts.

The wave of corporate bankruptcies are going to jump too. Rite Aid, for example, that just emerged from C11 in Sept, is considering filing again.

The banks that had agreed to fund their reemergence have been spooked by the tariffs and are refusing to release the funds they need to operate and try to rebuild. The shelves in those stores are empty.

A good friend of mine sits in the C-Suite there so the above is fact.

I understand the goal of what is trying to be done but it’s unlikely to work out the way they want it to. I hope it does, but highly skeptical.

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Is $500 cost increase on a average car which now has a $50k sticker price outside the reach of a buyer who would have bought one recently. That is the estimate I’ve seen from some analysts.

I was surprised to see that $50k is now the average new car purchase, but based on my recent purchase believe it could be correct.

I have taken a wait and see attitude because there is a lot of slack.

I had a chat with my car dealer last week and cars have been flying off the lot. The sticker shock may take longer to happen because this volume has probably reduced short term demand.

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Considering how many “cars” I see advertised (more like small trucks, like the high-end Jeep that they don’t even say ‘Jeep’ anymore) that are base-priced at over $100K, $50K for “average” doesn’t surprise me. Too many people who have way too much money to spend on features they will probably never use.
OTOH, when I was a kid, the norm (although not for my family) was a new car every 2 years. Now the average age of a car on the road is just over 11 years old, so at least those super-high prices get amortized over a longer period. (Me? I’m driving a 2002 van I bought used in 2008; I intend to do my part to raise that number as much as I can. I’m in my 60s, this is only my 4th vehicle).

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The car we are looking at has a sticker of $44,202. That car is made in Japan.

It’s going to be 25% more expensive once current dealer inventory is sold. 25% on Invoice so not $53K but certainly a lot more than $44K. And certainly more than $44,702 - (+ $500)… Who are these analysts, because I would love to see the math they are using. I had no idea there was a 22X markup on cars.

Are you saying that car companies are just going to eat the 25%? I don’t think so.

Hopefully we lock down our purchase this coming week.

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The number I’ve heard (sorry, don’t remember the source, nor the timing, which could be critical) was that car prices would increase about $10K. Which seems in line with $50K being average selling price.

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I think the big hit for Chinese ecommerce sellers is going to be the de minimis exemption going away. Not only will that stall out the direct from China shipping model but it’s going to impact inbound shipments via ocean to US warehouses as well.

As the article notes, they are trying to shift to sending shipments to warehouses in the US. Great, but that does not bypass the new de minimis rules. What they have been doing is stuffing containers full of many different vendors and claiming de minimis on the entire container claiming each individual shipment was under $800 (if it was or not).

I’ve had many Chinese contact me the last week looking for answers as they are now coming to grips with what that means for their businesses. In no way am I happy how their businesses and families are being effected but to be quite frank, it’s about time. Now they have to compete on the same level as I do by paying import duties, tariffs, storage, etc. It’s a far more level playing field.

Yes, it’s going to cause pain at the register (or the online checkout) but a much larger percentage of those sales dollars are going to stay in the US promoting the local economy instead of Shenzhen.

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This is the bad news for Amazon Sellers. Maybe a generation from now, the US will have rebuilt an adequate (though still lagging) manufacturing infrastructure comparable to “the good ol’ days” of US manufacturing, but the here and now is untenable for many US-based brands, Sellers, and Buyers.

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Not all cars with Japanese badges are made in Japan. Some are made in the USA, just as some models of my Korean brand. This creates some more flexibility in pricing for the manufacturer since some of their product qualifies as American made.

Car manufacturers are already selling (or not selling) their electric vehicles at a loss, so selling cars which may have demand might have to be incentivized if the tariff will dampen the demand.

Of course, some car owners are not particularly loyal to a brand and will seek out a deal which is easier on their pocketbooks.

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20 posts were merged into an existing topic: :locked_with_pen: The Junk Drawer

Nationalism without infrastructure is just theater.

I’m all for reshoring. Economic security. Strategic independence.

But burning bridges without building boats isn’t sovereignty; it’s collapse on a delay.

Want to build America First?

Cool. Start by building. Not by blowing holes in the system and calling it strategy.

We’re not watching a plan unfold.

We’re watching policy cosplay; and the middle class is footing the bill.

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